16mm camera search

[Robert Paulsen]

Hi, I'm new to the forum.

I had a 16mm camera question. I am looking for a good sync sound camera and was told the CP 16 was a good choice for a good price. I was looking on Ebay and was wondering if this looked like a good deal?
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI...tem=1312811453

I have used 16mm a little but am mostly a Super 8 fan. The sound options are not important anymore on these CP cameras, like Super 8, correct? Thanks.

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[Scott Spears]

My question to you, is what's your budget for a 16mm camera?

The CP16 is an ok camera. Especially a CP16"R". I would also recommend checking into an Arri BL or Elcair NPR or ACL. They can all be found for $5000 and under. I have used all the above cameras and would give my personal recommendation to the Eclair NPR with the Arri BL a very, very close 2nd. Again, this all depends on the condition of the specific camera. I owned an Arri BL which was a noisy as hell and I traded for an NPR. I had used an BL many years before that was very quiet. One plus to the NPR is that it can be fairly expensively modified to shoot Super-16.

If you have some more money check out a Aaton LTR (usually $7000 and up.) Next is a Arri SRI starting as low as $9000. I own one and love it. It is a great workhorse.

Scott



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[MovieStuff]

I think the CP16R is a great camera. The lens mentioned is a little short. A 12-120 would be better but the fact that it is a Super 16 lens is great if you decide to modify the camera for super 16 later on. I would say that $1600 for everything they're offering is a steal. I've seen those cameras go regularly for $3,500 or more and often as much as $1800 for just a body and no lens. It's a nice, quite crystal synch camera and should last you a long time.

Roger

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Roger Evans
MovieStuff
http://www.afterimagephoto.tv/moviestuff.html

[Konton]

I got a CP-16 R/A camera for sale if you are looking for one. The CP-16 is a damn quiet camera. The R (or R/A) is better than the A I'm told. A friend of mine has an A and says he says the viewfinder during filming is useless. BTW: The R/A is not something between an A and an R. The A in R/A stands for "amplifer" which relates to the audio functions.

The CP-16's are actually quieter than the Eclairs. But the threading is more difficult since the threading takes place in the body of the CP-16, where as the Eclair threading is all in the magazine. This is a hassel in the middle of the shoot if you want to change magazines. I've done it and it's annoying to have people waiting around while you are trying to thread the film on the CP-16.

Anyway my feeling is about the same as everyone else. If you want an inexpensive crystal sync camera I'd go for a CP-16. If you have more money there are better options, but you'll need at least another grand. I'm selling my CP-16 for alot lower than the one you mentioned.

http://www.super8mm.org/sale/cinema_products_cp-16.html

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Konton the Grey

[This message has been edited by Konton (edited December 27, 2001).]

[Nigel]

I would give my stamp to the ACL but only the later models that can power the 400' mags. These are often called ACL 2's. They can be converted to S16 for about 1000-2000 dollars. I would say the the 7000 estimate for the Aaton is a bit low. I would stay away from the LTR7--I own an LTR54 and would just as soon sell it. Email me but I think it will be out of your price range.

I have also found that the BL is only good if you want a loud Tripod camera. Where as the ACL is nice if you want a quieter than the BL Tripod and Handheld camera.

Good Luck

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[MovieStuff]

I would say if Konton will sell his camera for less than the $1600 asking price of the ebay CP, then that's a real bargain, especially since he has the 12-120 lens. I would go for it if you have the money. Looks like a nice package, Konton.

Roger

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Roger Evans
MovieStuff http://www.afterimagephoto.tv/moviestuff.html

[This message has been edited by MovieStuff (edited December 27, 2001).]

[crimsonson]

Stay away from the Arri 16S and R16 if sound sync is your goal. The cost and time you will put to blimp those things is not worth it.

CP16R and Eclairs are a great choice. The French Eclairs are quieter than the English version.

My only prob with the BL is if you change lens you got to make sure the lens blimp is compatible with your lens. The camera are usually sold with a zoom lens blimp. You cant use it for those Arri primes. They are affordable, escpecially those Schnneiders. They are no Zeiss by no means stretch of your imagination, but they are sharper than the standard Angneiux zoom lens. I have seen Schneider primes from $150-500, depending on model, condition and year.

The CP16R can be converted to S16, but you got to make sure the shutter is a half moon (180 deg). I think the bow tie shutter cannot be converted to S16.

I am too is planning to get my first 16. I have worked with 16 but dont own one. Just want to pass the knowledge that I have gathered in the past several months.

Good Luck

BTW- have any of you guys worked with the Bolex H 16 EL? How is that thing?

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[This message has been edited by crimsonson (edited December 28, 2001).]

[MovieStuff]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Courier, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Robert Paulsen:
The CP16 just seems like more of a camera that is heavy and intrusive.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Nah. It was a news camera and is made out of aluminum. It's really easy to shoulder and I personally didn't think it weighed that much when I had mine. Nice solid camera. I think it's particularly light, considering it's a self blimped camera. I don't think you'd be dissapointed at all. It as multiple speeds as well, but no reverse. Konton's price is so good I'd buy it if I had the dough.

Roger

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Roger Evans
MovieStuff
http://www.afterimagephoto.tv/moviestuff.html

[Robert Paulsen]

Agreed Roger,

I would probably be more interested in Konton's package if that were the case. However, I am pretty new to the 16mm format and have only used an Arriflex 16S. My price range is around $1500. I'm interested in the a quiet camera with crystal sync, but what other speeds does this camera have, just 24fps? The Arriflex is great but yeah it's not crystal controlled or all that quiet. I like that it can take 100ft loads and has the different speeds and lenses though. The others are maybe the R16? Suggestions? Can I successfully get a good price and maybe do sync sound with the Arriflex 16S? Maybe with head and tail slate, and a transfer to video? The CP16 just seems like more of a camera that is heavy and intrusive. Comparisons of prices and benefits around this price range for a 16mm camrera?

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[Konton]

I'm selling the CP-16 for $1300 which includes shipping. If you can pick it up in LA I'll bring the cost down. The camera has more speeds than just 24fps and I'll be happy to discuss all of that if you e-mail me directly.

I personally would not try sound sync with an Arriflex 16S. The cost to blimp and crystal sync it is not worth it. Better to work with an Arriflex BL. However don't you think the Arriflex BL is both heavy and intrusive?

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Konton the Grey